overheating

[Martin2]

OK ladies and gentlemen, I am stumped.  I am still overheating after installing new thermostate, water pump, fan clutch and recored radiator.  All of which were the recommended parts from the club.  Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions?  Would appreciate any help.  Tom

[cat]

Tom;  I've forgotten the beginning of your heating problems.  When you say "overheating", are you actually losing coolant or are you relying on the dash gauge?  Also, how fast do you drive when "cruising"?

[EKS]

Tom
Have you made sure your guage is correct. Have you checked for a blown head gasket? Exhaust gases leaking into the coolant will interfere with heat transfer. Most radiator shops have a tool they put in the radiator cap hole to test for exhaust gas. There were references to different water pumps in the back issues and it sounded like it is important which one you use. There are also additives that help with heat transfer like "water wetter" (see http://www.redlineoil.com/redlineoil/wwti.htm ) that definitely help. Depends upon where you live how much antifreeze you need. Pure water cools better than antifreeze. Be careful with that as your A/C can freeze the water in your Heater core and rupture it. Is something obstructing flow to the radiator. When/Where does it overheat. Plugging all the openings around the radiator forces more air through the radiator and that might help. Have you tested the thermostat (put it in a pan of water with a thermometer and see when it opens as you heat the water) to make sure it is not sticking. Any possibility of an obstruction in a hose or a hose collapsing (that does happen on the suction side which is why some are corrugated or have springs inside the hose).

[handyman]

Tom I'll throw my two cents in have you checked your engine timing? or your heat riser? two other things thatll cause over heating

[Martin2]

Thanks for the replys!  I'm not relying completely on the dash gauge, as I have pulled over and lifted the hood and the resivior is to max level and engine is very hot!  I cruise between 50 and 55 mph.  Granted, I have climbed some pretty steep grades, however, I overheat on level highways as well.  Now, on level roads, the gauge ranges from the center point to just under hot. I am sure of the parts being the right ones because they looked prety much like the ones which were replaced.  The radiator is newly recored and when looking at the antifreeze it is very clean.  I have drained the radiator to check.  As far as head or gasket I am not sure how to check for a blown gasket.  Wouldn't there be a sign of water in the oil if I had a cracked head?  The thermostat is new from the club, but I guess there is a chance it could be sticking.  Thank you all for the input, I apprreciate it.  Tom

[cat]

As someone recently suggested to get a mechanic who has a device that screws onto the radiator filler.  This will indicate if combustion gasses are leaking into the coolant.  Also coolant will not necessarily show up in the oil.  You may only (only?) have a blown gasket, not a cracked head.
 Since you said the res. tank is still full of coolant I'm suspicious of the gauge or sending unit giving you a false reading.  To be positive of a accurate temp. you could purchase a mechanical temp. gauge through J.C. Whitney (cheap) and hook it up (temporarily) just to establish what the actual temp. is.  Good luck.

[tmoncus]

I had overheating problems on an old Kings Highway with a 440 dodge.It gave me a fit for over a year. I did all the fixes you have done and it still overheated.I would drive 5 miles after every so called fix and would observe the temp.I got the temp down to about 225 after all the fixes including boxing in the Radiator and forcing all air thru it.I figured out ,by removing the thermastat that water was circulating to fast to cool.I had installed a aftermarket  165. I had been told by an individual that he had to iinstall a dodge 190 to cure his problems.I went to the dodge dealer and he brought out a termastat that looked like the aftermarket,so I asked for another.This second one had 3(three) holes for the water to go through.The cross sectionial area was mush smaller than the cone type thermastat. My temp went down to 180 and never got past 190 in Dallas on 100 a degree day.Im sure if you can find an old type thermastat with holes in the bottom it will fix your problem

[amclipper]

Tom
Try this; get your Clipper hot then turn your heater on and the fan on high.  See if the temperature goes down doing this.  If it does, could the thermostat be in backwards?  {The base with the "spring" goes in toward the engine.} Also the thermostat should have a bleed hole in the operator, is it blocked?  
Ed

[lechlite]

First of all, pure water will NOT cool as well an a proper mix of about 50/50 water/antifreeze. Also, when you replaced the water pump, did you get the heavy duty one that the 440 is supposed to have? That was alluded to in a past issue of The Clipper newsletter with the proper part number.  Checking your timing is also a good idea.  I have had intermitent heating problems with my 440 but it was loosing water intermittently to a blown headgasket. I just pulled the heads and am redoing them. You may have an obstruction somewhere in the system or your thermostat may be in backwards, as someone else stated. If you have a blown headgasket or cracked head(supposedly pretty rare on 440 heads according to many sources), you should be loosing coolant either to the combustion chamber/s or the crankcase. If you are loosing it to the crankcase, you will obviously get water in the oil, causing a milky look to your oil.  Also there's another long shot that a mechanic told me about. When these engines were made, sometimes casting sand and debris can be left in the bottom of the block and roil up even after you clean the radiator, etc., and replug it.  As I said, that is a long shot. Here's what I did and it seemed to help with the fan clutch. I put a heavier than stock fan clutch that really hauls the air and it seemed to cut the tendency to overheat to a bare minimum. Hope this was helpful. Dan Lechliter  #2592

[Larry C]

I'm not having an overheating problem when I'm driving, but when I stop and turn the engine off my gauge goes to the max and you can hear the water gurgling. If I try to start her up after a gas stop it has a hard time turning over, but so far I have been able to start it up. I replaced the raditor cap and that help boiling over when I shut it down, but still this problem. Any ideas? Dodge 440.

[EKS]

Larry
I had a similar problem with a 78 Clipper. The boilover is due to heat retained in the engine block that has to go someplace when you stop circulating the coolant. Some cars have a thermostat that will turn on an electric fan to blow air through the radiator if the temperature rises even with the key off (I had a Dodge Daytona set up that way).
Your options are either improve the effeciency of you existing system or install a bigger radiator or fan so the cooling system (external to the engine block) has either more coolant or cooler coolant which is better able to absorb the heat that comes out of the block when the engine is turned off. Take a look at the information at http://www.redlineoil.com/redlineoil/wwti.htm which talks about water having TWICE the cooling ability of a 50/50 water/antifreeze mix. If you question that call the local library or college and have someone look up each mediums ability to transfer heat.
A bigger fan might move more air so what was in the radiator was cooler but that takes horsepower and gets noisy. A radiator core that did a better job of dumping the heat works but gets expensive.
The most inexpensive option to test would be to try straight water (you can save your current coolant to put back in after the test). Read the info on the redlineoil site as it discusses the boilover issue after engine shut down. Test it with just water and if straight water makes enough of a difference you can add enough antifreeze so you have freeze protection for where you live. You could add other additives for corrosion protection. You could try water and Redline's waterwetter product if straight water doesn't quite cut it. That's pretty cheap compared to changing radiator, water pump, fan, etc.
I assume that you don't have restricted hoses etc. Severly restricted flow due to the wrong water pump might be a factor but moving lots of water through a radiator that can only transfer half as much heat doesn't seem like the answer. If it is not overheating while driving you're getting rid of enough heat to drive, just not enough that your cooling system can absorb the heat that soaks out of the block when your stop circulating the air through the radiator.
On the 1979 440 Dodge Clipper we use to tow a horse trailer we went to a core that fit the standard radiator top and bottom but had twice the surface area of the cooling tubes. We live in Montana and have to use lots of antifreeze due to the weather. We've never had a cooling problem since the radiator core change even pulling a loaded 4 horse trailer up the mountains.

[mollerus]

I belong to a Chrysler Imperial (1963 Crown Imperial 4 dr)chat line and have seen several posts about over heating that were traced back to resticted flow from collapsing of the lower radiator hose at prolonged high speed.  The 60's Imperials had a wire coil inside the lower hose to prevent collapsing but this was often left out when the hose was changed.  Apparently the efficiency of the havy duty water pump can create a negative pressure in the lower hose leading to a collapse and restricted water flow.  Hoses with cast in wire ribs are now available to prevent both collapsing and kinking on turns.  I've begun to wonder if some of the over heating problems with our 440s could be of similar origin?  I mention this to add yet another cause in the over heating problem.  By the way I've not had any problmes with overheating and I did note that my lower hose is the type with the wire imbeded in it.  Bob Mollerus